Subconscious rejection
Omigosh! I think it says "happy bitza"!
A Bitza-like community is so important. Singles, even if they don’t want to be single, probably will sooner or later want to be part of a community with people like themselves. It is not fun at all to be a single person in a family oriented community. It’s sort of like a temporary community until we hopefully find someone absolutely lovely to marry.
The problem is that people are becoming friends with people that are potential partners and being friends with each other often inhibits the development of something more. But because it’s uncomfortable and/or scary to go out of the comfort zone of friendship or being friendly with someone, I wonder if people are subconsciously passing up totally good opportunities. I’m calling this subconscious rejection. You may not even be giving it much thought, if any, but you subconsciously decide you’re just going to be friends with the person so as not to rock the boat.
Vera has said to me that when she was in the Bitza, it was practically incestuous to date within that community. She herself ended up marrying someone she was set up with from the outside.
The problem is that despite this very big drawback (if I’m right), these Bitza communities are SOOOOO important! I know from experience that we need to be with people who are similar to us, in similar situations. Is there a way to have vibrant singles communities but at the same time make sure they don’t inhibit us from making connections with potential partners?
One thing I can see helping – but I cringe when I think of it – is to have things a little more split by gender. Meaning, for example, more Shabbat meals of just guys or girls. I’m not sure why I’ve always been put off by women-only events (even though they can be so amazing) but I can see how doing things to acknowledge the difference between the sexes could possible keep a certain amount of healthy tension in the air.
I’ve heard 0f people who purposely make sure not to be part of this community because sometimes there is a feeling that it inhibits relationships from happening. I can totally see the logic.
What do you think? Any way to create a balance here or are we trying to have our cake and eat it too?
Picture by MShades at flickr.
Deena
Vera Resnick
I don’t think you’re single because you live here, I think you live here because you’re single. Living here doesn’t hold you back as much as it gives you the social support to hang in there. I do still check out my guy friends (some of whom I met by dating them), and quite a few couples I know connected after having known each other for years, so I don’t think living here is the cause of extended single-hood.
Long-timer, I just can’t help but think that this community has pros and cons to it and, in some ways, being part of it might make it more difficult to connect with “the one.” I’m not belittling the importance of having such a community but I’m wondering if there is at least a bit of a vicious cycle.
How the heck are religious singles supposed to meet each other if people keep pushing for more gender separation? Why shouldn’t we have a chance to get to know each other in a non-shidduch, non-singles-event forum? Or at least practise having a conversation with a peer of the opposite sex who is not our sister/brother/cousin when we’re not busy stressing about whether or not there is potential here for a second date…
Incidentally, I know plenty of couples who started off as friends and/or “intermarried” within the Katamon (or Givat Shmuel) incubator. Or how about an even better example – how many dati-leumi couples do you know who met in Bnei Akiva (assuming you know ppl who grew up here and not just Chutznikim)?
Sorry Deena, but I’m gonna have to disagree this time. No hard feelings?
I actually agree with you on this one – I think gender separation is possibly part of the cause, probably not part of the solution. I wonder why the BA framework does work for dating even though people are spending a lot of time together – but the “bitza” quasi-framework doesn’t seem to work? Just the age factor or maybe something more?
OMG, Deena and I are disagreeing – can habitza.com handle this? Only time will tell. ):::(‘…: (sorry, can’t get the hang of these smileys..)
OK people, OK! I didn’t say I for sure thought it was a solution. I was merely suggesting it as something to consider because of this thing I think I might be seeing of people not moving beyond friendship or friendliness. And rgoldstand, you’re taking my words to an extreme. To begin with I am talking about a community where almost EVERYTHING is co-ed so I’m not talking about taking a very seperate community and making it more seperate. I’m suggesting that maybe a little more seperation could help remind people of the differences.
You said things about having the opportunity to talk to someone of the opposite sex who isn’t a relative but that is taking it to the extreme because to begin with I’m not talking about such a divided community.
Look, maybe I’m totally wrong and people are moving beyond friendship when they feel potential. But if I am right, and people aren’t giving each other enough chances, do you have any other solutions in mind to remedy that?
Vera…. I hope we can survive this!
(Let’s make sure to discuss smilies at our next meeting. Very important for the good of the site.)
Oh, and what’s BA?
Hey hey hey, I *said* no hard feelings, right?
From my experience, it’s very rare to find a really compatible boy-girl pair who become (and stay) good friends without either one of them feeling any sexual tension. I’ve seen them *claim* it’s platonic, but one of them is always lying, and usually knows it (or figures it out fairly quickly).
PS: In a moment of painful honesty, allow me to point out that even in the MO world, there are still a few poor schlubs like me who spent their entire childhood and adolescence in separate schools and first encountered boys when it was time to start dating. So it comes as no surprise to me that there should be a shidduch crisis. And that, my friends, is my self-analysis for the night. I think I’m gonna go and hide under my lilypad now…